Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Dangerous Beans » Sun Oct 23, 2016 7:19 pm

Shockandawe wrote:
I don't think that para's ultimate goal was ever to purely be a community manager or organizer. They were stepping stones into his ultimate goal of some sort of complete takeover. While he may have made the game and servers much better, in the process he greatly eroded the community itself. Something I feared from the beginning.

This isn't a melodrama Shock, this is a video game. :smt044

By taking control of policing every aspect of the game himself he largely defanged the modsquad members. They were, quite honestly, no longer needed. This is why we're seeing a seemingly weak mod team.

Wrong. A weaker mod squad is a direct reflection of having a smaller and weaker player pool- which you yourself have previously argued is unavoidable in a game this old.

To put it simply Para destroyed the pillars of the community. Rebuilding is no easy feat.

To try and say Para is the reason people quit this game is ridiculous (did he chase some asshats away? yes as have all mods thats part of their function). Para was the main reason a lot of respectable players hung around as long as they did, and he was the only one who could organize events and get normally retired players into action. Para represented organization, accountability for players' actions, and competition- which without you might as well go play Sims or whatever. Its not a coincidence that multiple respected players hung up their hats for good once it became clear Para was permabanned.

You say others come on only to post negative stuff, but you only sign on to contradict what others say- and it doesn't even matter if you are right or not, its just a pissing match. You talk about not disparaging others and moving forward, but turn right around and in the same post point fingers on a player (and a legend of the game whether you like him or not) who doesn't even play anymore...


It would appear as though the mod squad needs a reboot. A larger than normal mod squad might be the best option to ensure that there is more control within the community. If it takes 10 people to properly moderate the community then don't be afraid to do it.

Yes lets just make every single active player in this game a Mod, not like we have a smaller than ever player pool, lets regulate it even more!
I always enjoyed playing in the same room as you and I still think you are a solid member of this community, but from my perspective, you are just being silly. Hopefully I have provided more points for you to argue over, Shock.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by imapickle » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:48 pm

If you do get someone to be tournament organiser or whatever, I suggest you choose someone who is tolerant, humble, flexible, willing to listen to feedback and able to delegate and let other people have creative input. Because those are the kind of qualities we could really use round here imo.

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Post by Bean » Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:25 pm

I'm not that absent mnemo, and if there were three or ten of me in full consultation with the so called "community" it would not fix the problems with bio deux or the broader online game. 10 mods. lol. It's a fun game for a few people. Very few people want to join, and if they do they are smacked around a good bit, long before they finish climbing the steep part of the learning curve. The management of the game has very little to do with it. Moderating behavior has very little to do with it. There just are not many real assholes left. The few luxers left are mostly lovely people but just not necessarily interested in playing nice with the "go fish" crowd when they are used to playing tournament bridge.

Sure, find a bio deux fan and make her a mod; that could help a bit. But, try some tinkering. That's my preference, but I'm not going to kill myself if the so called communities in Biodeux and IRE just keep cruising kindly and steadily toward oblivion. If that community figures out how to grow and not alienate new players, by all means consult with them and grow the game, whereupon I will step up a good bit more (IRE is no better. I notice new players getting bullied there every time.)

I'm here when things need to be done. I'm available for problem solving if anyone finds a true villain, or even just a slightly misguided soul, and would like some intervening. I have made my arguments and suggestions, and I will continue. I try to help makes games happen when I can, just not necessarily in your pet map. :smt049

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Diversity

Post by Bean » Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:28 pm

Does anyone else think of the Great Famine when they think of our monoculture of maps?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Famine_(Ireland)

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by hoodie » Mon Oct 24, 2016 12:29 am

Agreed with Bean.

People still like the shiny. Dustin, rework the raw. I've probably been saying for 10 years the scoring is driving people towards bad behavior, because it rewards it.

I have my idea of what should be rewarded, but if the community described what a good player would be like, and raw was built to reflect that, it'd hopefully attract and reward people who play the game rather than the system.

To start: I think there should be diminishing raw for playing the same map too many times, and bonuses for playing a variety of maps.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Dangerous Beans » Mon Oct 24, 2016 2:46 pm

The problem with diminishing RAW is that the remaining players who play this game consistently aren't interested in learning new maps or new ways of playing in general. They come to get their bio-slummage on, and that is all they want to do... for them that is Lux.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by The Silken Knot » Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:24 pm

Speaking of being welcoming to newbies...

It's gotta be frustrating for them to try to play with humans if they happen to join on the weekend. At the risk of making George's eyebrows bristle, maybe we could re-think the "all ranked, all weekend" thing?

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Centrico » Mon Oct 24, 2016 5:32 pm

The Silken Knot wrote:Speaking of being welcoming to newbies...

It's gotta be frustrating for them to try to play with humans if they happen to join on the weekend. At the risk of making George's eyebrows bristle, maybe we could re-think the "all ranked, all weekend" thing?

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by hoodie » Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:21 pm

Dangerous Beans wrote:The problem with diminishing RAW is that the remaining players who play this game consistently aren't interested in learning new maps or new ways of playing in general. They come to get their bio-slummage on, and that is all they want to do... for them that is Lux.
That's who we currently have. They aren't interested in doing anything different. I'm addressing a different pool of people, some who exist, some who are currently theoretical luxers that would be worth having around. (hell, I'm a theoretical luxer at this point)

I'm not promising any huge turnaround or renaissance, but I have *always* lived by the idea that you set the example by how you act and how you set the rules. We've set up rules that reward certain behaviors, and we've created a system that has evolved towards this through many variations. If we set some new parameters, we can possibly SLOWLY curate a new group that is interested in a different way of being. Some will come over from the current vortex, some will exist in their own enclaves despite the new scoring guidelines.

I think it's worth a try. My values might not be the values that get chosen. But choosing what you want to reward, then building rewards in that direction is a pretty smart way of going about things. And when there are weak spots in that system, patch it and improve it. It won't all happen in one go. But we know this ISN'T working right now, so why use that as proof of not doing anything else?

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by The Silken Knot » Mon Oct 24, 2016 11:16 pm

I think your first order of business might be answering this question:
  • Do I honestly want to move Lux forward, or is what I really want to relive 2005 (or 2007, or 2009, or 2012)?
Sure, there are numerous things that can be "fixed" in Lux as it stands today. Freezing rooms and lost turns, etc., are pretty high on my personal wish list. There are asshats and whiners in Lux today, but, judging from the forums, there always have been.

I have fun in Lux. Today, just as it is. That's pretty much all I ask of this game and these players. It's less fun for me with the glitches and it was more fun with hands-on tournament management and such. I've spent some time doing the giving-back thing. I've spent some time arguing when I disagreed with management (both dustin's and paranoiarodeo's). I've spent a lot of time interacting with players of many stripes.

I suspect this thread will ultimately go the way of so many others along these lines. Me? I just intend to keep doing what I do until Lux is no longer fun, or dies. That includes leading by example on the tracker, and not posting here instead.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Centrico » Mon Oct 24, 2016 11:29 pm

The Silken Knot wrote:I think your first order of business might be answering this question:
  • Do I honestly want to move Lux forward, or is what I really want to relive 2005 (or 2007, or 2009, or 2012)?
Sure, there are numerous things that can be "fixed" in Lux as it stands today. Freezing rooms and lost turns, etc., are pretty high on my personal wish list. There are asshats and whiners in Lux today, but, judging from the forums, there always have been.

I have fun in Lux. Today, just as it is. That's pretty much all I ask of this game and these players. It's less fun for me with the glitches and it was more fun with hands-on tournament management and such. I've spent some time doing the giving-back thing. I've spent some time arguing when I disagreed with management (both dustin's and paranoiarodeo's). I've spent a lot of time interacting with players of many stripes.

I suspect this thread will ultimately go the way of so many others along these lines. Me? I just intend to keep doing what I do until Lux is no longer fun, or dies. That includes leading by example on the tracker, and not posting here instead.

:smt049 :globe

mic...to the...drop. :smt020

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by hoodie » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:56 am

I learn over and over again... my time here is done. If people don't want to give it a shot, I've got other better things to do. Good luck everyone, in all you do. I'm sure I'll visit, but I have to stop even spending mental energy trying to fix stuff when its clear that time has long past. Happy Luxtober.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by The Silken Knot » Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:53 am

I'm not sure how you interpreted that as "people not wanting to fix Lux".

I'm out there just about every day, doing what I can. And yes, having fun with what exists now. But if we can't be honest about our own motivations, or the amount of effort we personally are willing to commit, I don't know how anyone can expect to effect real change.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Symbiosis » Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:07 am

Unless dustin wants to put in substantially more effort (unlikely) or somebody else wants to put in the level of commitment para had a couple years ago (even less likely), there's really nothing to be done. Sooooo let's drop it I say.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Centrico » Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:27 am

hoodie wrote:I learn over and over again... my time here is done. If people don't want to give it a shot, I've got other better things to do. Good luck everyone, in all you do. I'm sure I'll visit, but I have to stop even spending mental energy trying to fix stuff when its clear that time has long past. Happy Luxtober.
Hoodie, as chance would have it I read the first post you made, prior to erasing it and changing it to this one, and I honestly feel that maybe you should give this all another chance.

Sometimes we mis-interpret an individual's passionate perspective on an issue we care about (Lux), through the color of how our own personality relates to the same issue. Reading this thread I can GUARANTEE THIS ONE THING ABOUT EVERYONE WHO POSTED HERE:

Everyone here loves this place, sure they have their reasons, their ambitions, their visions, but maybe it's time we started (this goes for us all, myself included, don't think it's directed at you) trying to appreciate those that hold opposing views for the fact that they too love what we ourselves care about, hell, that must be worth something, if nothing more than them patting you on the back and saying, "wow mate, you really love a great thing".

In closing, even if you don't agree with all my preachy lux-o-Babble you still have to stick around because I am having too much fun playing "Name that Luxer: Pimp My Ride Edition" with you!

Thanks for your perspective, I'm sure as the Roulette Wheel of Lux turns it will come back and rest where it should for that moment in time.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Shockandawe » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:16 pm

You misunderstood what I meant when I said Pillars of the Community DB and that is my fault. I meant that in regards to roles within the community, (mods, hosts, etc.), and they are clearly weaker.

Let's say you are reliant on a certain food source to survive, fish for example. Everyday a fisherman goes out and comes back with food for you. You have become reliant on him for food. One day he disappears without ever having taught you how to fish.
The community became complacent in that para was doing everything for them. Now everyone is finding out what level of commitment it takes to keep things running smoothly. You have to learn how to fish for yourself. You have to recreate the environment that you want. This is not easy nor something that happens overnight.

I've never questioned para's skill within the game, but the game itself and it's community are clearly two different entities.

In the last roughly 10 months there have been posts by 3 moderators in the moderation log one of which, guillerme, appears to have moved on. That leaves 2 active mods as far as I can tell.

There aren't enough moderators when there was a post in this very thread asking where they are. You are badly exaggerating when you compare my suggesting more mods with a lighter commitment is going to suddenly lead to everyone being mods. If you have people that aren't willing or able to devote large amounts of time being a moderator then you adjust by adding a few more. I would think this is a fairly simple concept. You lighten the commitment required by the individual so that the moderation team can be strong.

This applies to any community no matter the size. The question is are there enough people left willing to commit to large scale improvement?

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Dangerous Beans » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:38 pm

No doubt they are weaker, but why is the fisherman at fault for not teaching those who like fish how to fish?

Community regulation should start at the bottom, with players regulating themselves and each other, when someone got out of line it was the players who handled the issue, and if they were unable to a mod was involved. I fear putting more mods into a game where the players would rather /report every little nuance or ignore it rather than regulate it themselves (often times for fear of in-game retaliation, especially knowing not a lot of players will stand up to a bully and they risk getting into an asshat-war alone) is a move that just increases regulations without solving the issue at its core (Pillars of the Community).

Did Para fill a huge void, and did his absence make that void more apparent? Yes, and yes.

Is Para responsible for that void? Not really.

To reiterate, you yourself have acknowledged that this is just the life cycle of a 10+ year old video game, could Dustin have done more things to help which would have resulted in a different Lux-world than what we see today? Yes, but he had no real obligation to, other than by the insistence of the people playing his game 10+ years after it came out.

If Dustin wants to recruit new mods that's his prerogative, but I don't think it will have such a big effect on Lux as some may think. But you are right, only 2 mods is a sad state of affairs, but who is left to commit?

I just enjoy, or try to, what Lux currently is as what it is, and anyone who expects this place to get a significant remodeling on an old ass game (although Risk/"Lux" itself is timeless) has their heads in the clouds.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Shockandawe » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:09 pm

Dangerous Beans wrote:No doubt they are weaker, but why is the fisherman at fault for not teaching those who like fish how to fish?

Community regulation should start at the bottom, with players regulating themselves and each other, when someone got out of line it was the players who handled the issue, and if they were unable to a mod was involved. I fear putting more mods into a game where the players would rather /report every little nuance or ignore it rather than regulate it themselves (often times for fear of in-game retaliation, especially knowing not a lot of players will stand up to a bully and they risk getting into an asshat-war alone) is a move that just increases regulations without solving the issue at its core (Pillars of the Community).

Did Para fill a huge void, and did his absence make that void more apparent? Yes, and yes.

Is Para responsible for that void? Not really.

To reiterate, you yourself have acknowledged that this is just the life cycle of a 10+ year old video game, could Dustin have done more things to help which would have resulted in a different Lux-world than what we see today? Yes, but he had no real obligation to, other than by the insistence of the people playing his game 10+ years after it came out.

If Dustin wants to recruit new mods that's his prerogative, but I don't think it will have such a big effect on Lux as some may think. But you are right, only 2 mods is a sad state of affairs, but who is left to commit?

I just enjoy, or try to, what Lux currently is as what it is, and anyone who expects this place to get a significant remodeling on an old ass game (although Risk/"Lux" itself is timeless) has their heads in the clouds.
He is at fault because he created an environment where people didn't need to. Sure they could host games, but why bother when someone is already doing it better?

By doing everything himself and creating a situation where everyone was reliant on him and only him to do things he created the potential for the void that exists now. If he had restricted himself from moderating and encouraged more people to host this void would not be what it is. People expected Dustin to step in with the same 24/7 attitude that para had, which is simply not realistic for anyone nor is it probably healthy.

I completely agree with you on community regulation. That it needs to start from the bottom, but I'm not seeing that here. Since when would the comments that George made earlier have ever been considered acceptable? This isn't the first instance recently of people making comments just like his and yet no one is stepping in. I'm not talking about increasing regulation. I'm talking about bringing it closer to where it has been in the past. It may just take a few more people now than it did then.

I still stand by what I said about the game being old, but that was in reference to community size. When people were all in that there was a theoretically huge amount of people out there just waiting for a few tweaks. That the community would see a massive amount of influx if small details were changed.

A small community can still be plenty strong.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by hoodie » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:14 pm

For all curious, my other post was essentially that I have a ton of stuff on my plate in life (yes, all good things, but a lot of it... and on top of it all Halloween is like Fire Christmas so I have ridiculous amounts of events and performances to wrangle right now)

Anyways, I don't have time or wherewithal to play games. I'm an artist and designer and am interested in social interactivity of groups and structures that foster positive growth. Intellectually, this is ridiculously interesting to me. It is my work and I have a ton of experience in it. And it's not about rebuilding what was, as much as an interest in what a renaissance and different online society would be like.

At the same time, I'm just not in a place to lead by example in the tracker. You can lead a horse to water, I don't have time to even lead the horse to water. I can tell the horse where the water is, and if the horse wants to walk to the water and drink it, AWESOME. If the horse is happy where it is, there's no need for me to walk the horse there and waste all our time. I'm not the one that owns the horse, and I'm not the horse. It's between the two of you.

As I said, only the best to everyone. It's just a reminder we're in different places. That's not a bad thing, I just don't fit here anymore. All the best.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Centrico » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:31 pm

hoodie wrote:For all curious, my other post was essentially that I have a ton of stuff on my plate in life (yes, all good things, but a lot of it... and on top of it all Halloween is like Fire Christmas so I have ridiculous amounts of events and performances to wrangle right now)

Anyways, I don't have time or wherewithal to play games. I'm an artist and designer and am interested in social interactivity of groups and structures that foster positive growth. Intellectually, this is ridiculously interesting to me. It is my work and I have a ton of experience in it. And it's not about rebuilding what was, as much as an interest in what a renaissance and different online society would be like.

At the same time, I'm just not in a place to lead by example in the tracker. You can lead a horse to water, I don't have time to even lead the horse to water. I can tell the horse where the water is, and if the horse wants to walk to the water and drink it, AWESOME. If the horse is happy where it is, there's no need for me to walk the horse there and waste all our time. I'm not the one that owns the horse, and I'm not the horse. It's between the two of you.

As I said, only the best to everyone. It's just a reminder we're in different places. That's not a bad thing, I just don't fit here anymore. All the best.
Ah buddy, you fit great.

You don't have to play in the tracker to have an opinion, or more importantly to play photo games in the forum :smt023

That being said, what kind of designer/artist are you? Do you do any web work (not to be confused with wet work :smt071

Good luck with your to do list, I know this is a busy time of year.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by The Silken Knot » Tue Oct 25, 2016 2:26 pm

I have to say, hoodie, my post was not dissing anyone. I don't know if your post was in response to me, but if so you are recasting it into something it was not.

I asked a valid question, which I hope made people think beyond the posts they've made on this issue in the past... and I expressed what I personally was and wasn't willing to do at this point. If we just regurgitate the past, I have serious doubts this thread will lead to actual change. That is not directed at any one poster. It's meant as a prod to step back and start thinking about where we are now, and go from there.

As you may remember, I was a forum denizen and very rarely played online for years. So I certainly understand how one can love this place from either vantage point!

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by GFips » Tue Oct 25, 2016 7:03 pm

Hey, i have watched this and also want to give my 2 cents about.

I think pointing to others and looking back, insulting each other, discussing whos fault something was in past, “what would be, if …” and so on does not bring us any step forward (we have plenty of forum threads ending in nothing discussing that past history). It is time to look forward and I want to thank mnemo and the others for the open words and the constructive suggestions. I think they really have some important valid points. Maybe we cannot get major changes, but each step forward is a good thing. We don't need haters, we need help :-)

Just a few open thoughts from my side to think about:

In the last 2 years there have been added many features (e.g. exp-cards, winners-picks, separated rankings for classic) that have been requested by the community. For sure, bugs still need to be eliminated and there are still many possibilities for further improvements, but I doubt changes on the game side would bring us really more players at the moment. The separate classic ranking was a request from the skilled classic players, but it is still very tough to get a FH room. Lux is a great game. People wanted "winner picks map" rooms, but only a few played there.
If there are great ideas, we should listen and try to improve things. But IMHO the most important changes have to be done within the community. We just need to use all the possibilities lux offers and bring back the fun as first major step. How? Honestly. I have no answer. I don’t think this is just only done by adding a feature, changing the raw formula, .... We need fun events and tournaments people really like and enjoy to play. In past we had great volunteers (SnyperEye, Mentor09, Para hosted many fun events, people like moliheda invented the WTA ranking, …). People were actively involved and not just "players". They were not official sillysoft members and many things have also been not perfect, but it was fun! The work and the ideas were all done by the community itself. We had a variety of hosts, we had plenty of map mappers around. I think it is too easy to call this all only Dustins job now. We bought the game for a very fair price to have fun for many years. There is no yearly fee. If we want this all done by Dustin/Sillysoft I think a yearly fee for playing online tournaments would be mandatory (please calculate this yourself).

Having a tournament master organizing monthly tournaments would be great and also my wish to have. In addition a “community manager” would be a great idea. I don't think it would be good to ever bundle too much power in one person. But this all would costs time and probably money. But i doubt People would be willing to pay much money. So we need more volunteers.

Unfortunately many great names are gone, they had set high standards, but I encourage everybody to host own games and even to try to organize your own tournaments (we had so many great games beside classic lux games: winter games, football games, 1vs1, teamgames, Ninja tournament, easter eggs, manic monday, Gladiators, …). I am sure Dustin and the mods will support you on all sides. Even Mentors ranking page is still working and open for everybody to create own tournament ranking if needed.

If you don’t like the sillysoft hosts because of being unstable, then host your own games! I remember all the great hosts (Whirl, Aqua, Mentor09, … ) who hosted not only headless, but where present to create a fun environment in their hosts. It was always a pleasure to play there – not just because of the games, but also because of the fun in chat. Actually we nearly only have sillysofts hosts left. That needs to be changes. Dustin gets blamed for a lot. I could understand if he is not much motivated in organizing a tournament if half of the people say in advance that they don’t want to give him a chance and some even want to see failing it.

We are a great community and I believe together we can do a lot, but only if we really want! So i encourage you to keep discussing here and I still have the hope we can improve some things together.

and let me add some personal notes about the mod discussion:
I don't think it is fair to criticize Bean this way- he does a very good job behind the scenes! I am very glad he is here to help me as mod.
Unfortunately it is true, that Guillerme is afk for a while now. I hope he is fine and just busy. Sadly, I actually have no contact to him. But we should not speculate about him or what the reasons might be as long as we have no Infos.
The mods are also humans, make faults and have a life outside of lux and we mods are all yolunteers (which is imho good so). If you feel we do something bad/wrong, contact us or speak with dustin. I assure you, we all try to give our best, but is not always easy to be fair to everybody and to respond to respond to as many people's needs as possible. I grant you, that every single report will be read (even if it does not always result in a reaction) and that we mods try to be present. While i agree that the mod squad could need some additional fresh blood (which is Dustins decision), I don’t think names should be discussed here in public (talk directly to Dustin or with the present mods if you want to bring in names)

So i encourage us all- IT IS ALSO ON US- not only on Dustin!

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Centrico » Tue Oct 25, 2016 7:17 pm

i volunteer to pay for a monthly web server for stable games. I have a number of linux based servers i am already paying for now, I don't mind adding another server to the rotation. However, i'd rather not recreate the wheel.

Put me in touch with someone who has hosted before and wants to be involved with handling resets in case I am afk.

Lets get something out of this heart wrenching convo.

I plan to do it right, @ a data center, not from home where it is subject to outages.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Dangerous Beans » Wed Oct 26, 2016 6:38 pm

hoodie wrote:I learn over and over again... my time here is done. If people don't want to give it a shot, I've got other better things to do. Good luck everyone, in all you do. I'm sure I'll visit, but I have to stop even spending mental energy trying to fix stuff when its clear that time has long past. Happy Luxtober.
Word up, Hoods.

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by imapickle » Wed Oct 26, 2016 6:45 pm

GFips wrote: I don't think it is fair to criticize Bean this way- he does a very good job behind the scenes! I am very glad he is here to help me as mod.
:smt023

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Llama LluxaLlot » Thu Oct 27, 2016 6:22 am

The Silken Knot wrote:I have to say hoodie

So do I . h o o d i e . Yeah feels good .

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Red Beard » Tue Nov 01, 2016 12:32 am

Okay, I've read this whole thread and I love the enthusiasm and the genuinely constructive dialogue is wonderful and quite refreshing!

I have only one suggestion to throw into the mix and it's something that I (as well as others in the past) have mentioned it before. But after an awesome night of enjoying the fruits of this idea, I feel that this might be one of the best ways to bandage up many of the broken parts of lux and resolve many of the continued debates that we have here. It would require some work on dustin's part, but not nothing crazy. It goes something like this:

Dustin: Start making all of your hosts winners pick. All of them. Let people pick, on the spot, the maps that they want to play. Create a pool of 40-50 of the most playable and popular maps (with some odd balls here and there) and make a half way decent interface for players to easily pick the map they want to play by chat command.

Want people to play and get to know a variety of good maps?! Use winner picks. Want people to earn an actually good reward for winning?! Let them play the map that they want when they win. There are such a huge number of wonderful maps to choose from; it's a great asset of this game that is severely underutilized. Why? Because those maps are not accessible on a player by player basis. You are always at the mercy of the host.

If you can make it so those maps are easily available for each individual player to choose WHEN THEY EARN IT, it might go a long way to spicing the game up. If people want to win and vote to just keep playing bio, then so be it. But it gives every player the opportunity to play the next game that they want so long as they're good enough (or lucky enough) to beat the players who chose the map before.

I suggested a modest pool of 40-50 of the most playable maps because, hell, people could easily troll and throw in a map that is a real dud and wreck a room. And if we're honest, then I think we can all agree that those exist! People could then vote in the forums what maps they want to change in and out from month to month... say maybe 5-10 at a time.

A worthwhile intuitive interface where someone could also then set the card% and cont% easily with out having to scramble around to figure out the right command would also be necessary. I am not so naive as to think that this would be an easy task, but it IS something that can be done with the existing app and if you pulled it off successfully, it could be a totally different game. Seriously, what do we have to lose?

ALL WINNERS PICK! ALL OF THE TIME! Hurray!

Thoughts?

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by plane crazy » Tue Nov 01, 2016 10:55 am

Yo Redbeard,

I respect you for your play and company. Don't take this personally, but you asked for thoughts on your winners pick idea.
Start making all of your hosts winners pick. All of them. Let people pick, on the spot, the maps that they want to play.
That would take all the fun of lux away for me.
I hate learning new maps. It is too much work for my poor old brain.
Want people to play and get to know a variety of good maps?! Use winner picks. Want people to earn an actually good reward for winning?
I do not play this game to satisfy what others may "want". My spare time is too valuable.
As for "earning" a reward for winning, I maintain a game well played and a chance to play again is a just reward, and most satisfying.

Respectfully,

P. Crazy

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by plane crazy » Tue Nov 01, 2016 11:09 am

Here is my comment on the direction of Lux, or How to fix Lux, or not :idea: .

This game is ancient. There can only be a handful of on-line games this old that are still active. The fact there are still a couple hundred people playing, it’s well....I think it is a miracle every Monday when I log-on to Lux and see an active tracker.

As for what direction should Lux take now? To last another 13 years, SillySoft (or whoever Dustin sells Lux to) would have to spend some money. Lux would need, an on-duty manager, stability up-dates, marketing, support and then it might become a profit center and we could see the thousands of new players we need to keep playing for years to come.

Or we all just enjoy the ride on this old :llama till it drops dead. Then we friends through the ether scatter with the wind, never to be seen again.

It really is that simple.

Cheers,

Mr. P. Crazy

No Llamas were actually harmed here today

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Re: Luxtoberfest side issues - charting a way forward'

Post by Red Beard » Tue Nov 01, 2016 6:46 pm

Hey plane!

I feel very similar to you in terms of your second post. I think that the fact that this game is still active after so long is only a testament to what a good run it has had.

Regarding your 1st post, I take no disrespect! Quite the opposite really! And I get that often learning new maps continuously can potentially be challenging. I am not surprised to find that some people would not be happy with a change. In fact, I kind of think that that is true with almost any change that can be implemented. There are always going to be people who are dissatisfied with either the status quo or any change there in. I have no doubt that that is half the reason why so little about this game changes. It's a damned if you do damned if you don't sort of situation and many times when change occures, be the outcome positive or negative, it seems to always meets resistance of some form.

For me, I am fine regardless. I like Bio well enough that having it be the staple doesn't particularly bother me (*GASP* I know!). But the question for me is whether or not a change of this sort would keep more players coming back consistently or even fosters the growth of the community in the long run. I would love to see more new players around and continuously coming back, despite the headache that the inherent learning curve can create. And if that change attracts older players who might happen to wander in to give this game another thought, then even better!

I don't know. There are no easy solutions here, otherwise I suspect that they would have been implemented to rowdy cheers long ago. I especially hate the idea of losing good players like you, who are always a pleasure to have in the room. It's a gambit. But I also suspect that the more familiar people become with various maps, the more they might find that they really enjoy them. If it ever WERE to be implemented, I would hope that you would at least give it a go! Perhaps it's not as much of a mental knot as you might suspect!

Thank you for your input and thoughts on the matter. They are worthwhile and important to consider and I suspect that there are many who have not spoken here, who would mirror your feelings on the subject.

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