New Law !!!

Game of universal domination. New dice available free upon request.
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shock-n-ya'll
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New Law !!!

Post by shock-n-ya'll » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:03 am

Tired of turtles? Want them to go away, FOREVER!!!!! ? Then here is a new LAW. when a turtle is dicoverd ALL players will hit the turtle with a minimum of 10% each round until the turtle is gone.... I have no doubt this will stop anyone from going turtle... true it may take a month or two but it will stop when it is realized that it no longer has any value. :idea:

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General K
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Post by General K » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:23 am

Turtle Soups... yummy!

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kitty on catnip
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Post by kitty on catnip » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:26 am

turtling IS playing for first...

why does noone seem to understand that...

lux isn't about gaining income, and getting larger, it's about winning , and most importantly...

S U R V I V A L

you can't win if you're dead , now can you?

sigh

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my wife hates me
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Post by my wife hates me » Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:02 am

You also assume that all players can hit the turtle. By the time a turtle hits round 3 or 4, they are most likely down to one country where only 2 or 3 players can touch them.

...and wouldn't everyone hitting the turtle be considered teaming?



:wink:

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nimrod7
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Post by nimrod7 » Mon Dec 17, 2007 7:17 am

What Kitty said.

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Lantern
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Post by Lantern » Mon Dec 17, 2007 7:30 am

I must agree with Kitty.

Turtling is definitely a strategy. We are all dealt a random draw of countries, some are luckier than others. Sometimes turtling is your only option.

Now, that being said. Some players do it far better than others. The more experienced will know they will be turtling in round 1 or 2 and plan it out so they can cash at 3 and be in a country out of the way like japan or india.

Given a choice no one would want to turtle, but as Kitty said its all about surviving and winning. Sometimes its your only option.

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Post by Scad » Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:12 am

Turtling is only a strategy within a certain number of turns in any high card setting. Sorry, Lantern, but there's a difference between nomad and turtle. Somebody cashing in round three and hiding in Japan is ridiculous. You won't win that way. Maybe second or third, but I direct your attention to the very specific difference between that and winning. Nomading means you keep taking cards, keep up with the army counts. Yes, you have to be lucky, and good, to not get taken for your cards. If you get over three cards you're generally screwed. But turtling requires a lot more luck and a lot less skill to wait for someone to botch a kill within such a narrow margin that you can make it over there and kill, provided that you are the next player to be able to do so, AND THEN you have to survive long enough, after rounds of turtle income, to cash your new cards, unless someone conveniently smacked a five-card-holder. Maybe it's me, but I smell a lot of "if" coming off that "strategy." Turtling is far more about playing for second or third and conserving raw than it is about actual survival. It's not about "how can I win," but about "how can I avoid losing until a few other players have died first."

shock called it, though I hardly think that turtles are annoying enough to merit targetting. It's not like they're asshats, just cowards. Don't reward the behavior and maybe it'll cease to perpetuate.

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Better idea (I think)

Post by Crawford » Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:31 am

Okay, a subject I feel strongly about! I was thinking about this the other day when I had no choice but to turtle and was team killed. I have a suggestion. I'm gonna copy/paste this into the features section too...

I think that even though it's not exactly the same as RISK, this game is supposed to be better anyway, so here's my idea.

If a player holds less than X amount of countries (say 3 since the smallest conts have 4), and does not take a country for one turn, the next turn he gets 0 income! Simple! Then turtles have to stick with what they got to start with as soon as they get down to 3 countries remaining, which is pretty much inevitable considering in Classic everyone takes one of five conts and the other gets whored out to everyone for their satelllite/farming.

Sounds not quite perfect in eliminating turtles, but definitely would make it an even LESS attractive option for an already undesirable strategy.

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Post by SnyperEye » Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:36 am

I don't think turtling is a bad thing. For me it would be strategy. However, when I turtle I turtle with at least 1 or 2 cards. While I wait for the chance for someone to have bad dice and steal a kill for a cash and then im back in the game easily.

The people that turtle with 0 cards are the ones that are the pain in the butt. You have no chances of winning period. unless someone chokes on killing someone with 5 cards right before your turn. Which is very rare!

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Post by 3DA » Mon Dec 17, 2007 11:37 am

I think turtling is a viable strategy. It is perhaps not the most noble of routes, but it does work every once in a while. The wholesale elimination of turtles and turtling is a fun idea, but something that is not ultimately good for the game.

This to General K: how about turtle soup with a side order of turnips? :)

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Post by nimrod7 » Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:04 pm

Crawford my friend, I don't like it one bit. And here's why. When I turtle, it isn't necessarily for the whole game. It may be for 1-3 rounds or until someone gets half killed. While it doesn't happen often, I have won a few games by turtling. Penalizing someone for not moving is...hmmm...unfair? I see it as a legitimate strategy.

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Boruch
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Nim is right

Post by Boruch » Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:20 pm

Turtles are subject to undo prejudice
We must feel there pain, especially when Tide suggests their extinction.

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Re: Nim is right

Post by nimrod7 » Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:35 pm

Boruch wrote:Turtles are subject to undo prejudice.
Kind of like half killers huh?

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Post by the tide » Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:39 pm

Boruch wrote:Turtles are subject to undo prejudice
We must feel there pain, especially when Tide suggests their extinction.
My suggestion only applies to turtles that do not have the words 'the' and 'tide' in their name.

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Post by TurnipSlaya » Mon Dec 17, 2007 12:40 pm

1 Turtle who is also homeless is fine, but 2 turtles with 0 cards each or even worse a turtle holding a cont, esp. EU is a bunch of sh**!

Game in point, http://sillysoft.net/lux/rankings/game/526664, had two turtles sitting in Af with no cards, I made two single kill turns and was up 20 armies on Mr. Rodeo close to 300 armies, wherein said Mr. Rodeo attacks me leaving me with 3 armies, him with about 20 (0 showing in the 20 countries of mine he killed) and our turtles sitting pretty with 50 and 70 armies. And guess who wins, our freeking turtles!

I believe any turtle with 0 cards should be killed off by all. If they hold 1 card, which is what I do if turtling, then they may turtle, otherwise the mob should feast on turtle soup!

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Post by hoodie » Mon Dec 17, 2007 1:42 pm

I'm fine with someone turtling if they have a legit reason, including a series of bad dice. It happens, and turtling can make sense. The problems arise when people seem to turtle at the first chance they can get. I assume these are bad players who have to feast off of others' mistakes rather than doing well for themselves. I think it's good to take these folks out as a group because they aren't doing the work of helping to move the game along and never had the intention to.

It's a line that I draw and others might not. But I think a lot of people have probably made similar observations.

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Re: New Law !!!

Post by 3DA » Mon Dec 17, 2007 1:52 pm

shock-n-ya'll wrote: ... here is a new LAW. when a turtle is discovered ALL players will hit the turtle with a minimum of 10% each round until the turtle is gone...
If we can change the wording of this to read, "... when Big Will E. Style is discovered turtling ALL players will hit Big Will until he is gone ..." then I'm all for it.

Other famous habitual turtles that I wouldn't mind inserting are: Cheech. Also, Chops. :)

Kidding, boys. You're all good players and I don't begrudge you your turtling ways. I think, also, the time is right to reintroduce The Curse of the Suicidal Turtle.

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Post by Dominator » Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:00 pm

I've won many games as a nomad or a turtle. Both of these are valid strategies if done correctly. I only turtle when my situation is hopeless, but i have seen many people turtle simply because they are the nomad and not because they are threatened. When players turtle all the time it gets annoying...

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Post by kitty on catnip » Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:04 pm

true, some do it much more frequently than others...

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General K
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Post by General K » Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:06 pm

Do not forget the Famous Book of Turtling written by the respected Author pcristov aka Sensei pcristovushowerboyusasshatusmaximus.

500 pages of guiding luxers into turtle world with the classics "take Japan 1st", "never turtle in Middle East" and most importantly "do not breath or type while turtling".

Special edition just released and you can find it in libraries at 9.99 only!




:D

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Post by Drifter » Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:20 pm

Just last nite we had a player (you know who you are) turtle on round one. That's right, first round, never took a card, never moved. They just placed where they started, messing up everyone else on a quest to gain a continent. By the time I kicked them out of EU and finally got a piece of land to call my own, I could not cash on 4 and guess who went out first? Next to go was the player in NA, where the turtle decided to put the majority of troops. Then finally the turtle was rewarded with 4th. They're only answer was they had a bad start... how can anyone tell on round one? Hell, my fish are more aggressive, even the little one who hides under the rocks.

I'll still give it a shot with a bad start, you never know what could happen. If someone has to turtle, at least get out of everyone's way and get out of the way of traffic so you do not ruin the game.

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Post by Packman » Mon Dec 17, 2007 5:37 pm

As I've given this more thought turtling in 0% classic is much different than turtling in 30% deux with OZ and India. It really can be annoying if the player who turtles ALWAYS turtles, especially when someone misses a kill and YOU end up being turtle food. However, I believe it is a legit strategy and this thread borders on turtle discrimination!

In fact it IS TURTLE DISCRIMINATION! I ASK FOR, NAY, I DEMAND EQUAL RIGHTS FOR ALL TURTLES! DOWN WITH THE CRUEL TEAMERS CALLING FOR THE OUTLAWING OF TURTLES RIGHTS!!!

:lol:

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Post by Scad » Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:13 am

Pack is channeling deez nuts...

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Post by cheech99 » Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:05 pm

Another time that it is advantageous to turtle is if your turn immediately follows Kitty's turn. Simply turtle with enough armies to get from one side of the board to the other, and have 1 card just in case. Wait for the ensuing half kill and clean up... the game is yours !

:smt044

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Post by jOnNiE » Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:11 pm

the tide wrote:
Boruch wrote:Turtles are subject to undo prejudice
We must feel there pain, especially when Tide suggests their extinction.
My suggestion only applies to turtles that do not have the words 'the' and 'tide' in their name.
:smt044

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Post by shock-n-ya'll » Wed Dec 19, 2007 11:43 pm

well i think my point was not made clear here. I am not like totaly "against turtles" hell I do it too sometimes and ya it does work maybe 1 out of ten or so, my point is that it can be done away with if we all want it to go away. and ofcourse if you are not next too the turtle then you cant hit the turtle, most most games the turtle is in asia and asia is normaly farm land, so most peeps can hit the turtle. 8)

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Post by Grozoth » Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:47 am

The Laws:

2) IF you happen to have a shitty start, you should take it like a man and lose first.

3) If you decide to put up a fight anywhere for any continent, you are a suiciding moron and will be flamed/hated on for multiple other games as a punishment for your treasonous acts.

4) If you decide to "turtle" in some faraway asian land in order to avoid us, we will team up on you and slowly peck you into oblivion with no regard for our own victory because YOU DESERVE TO DIE FIRST.

5) You should do the polite thing and walk back in forth in Asia like a cow waiting for the butcher, you will be politely greeted with comments like "thanks for burning" when you blow up your outer forces to faciliate the victories of those with better starts, and "gg" when you are finally consumed for your cards so that the victory of others may be more easy.

6) You shalt not complain of your predicament, you have been chosen by Lincoln to die first with your godawful start.

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Post by Drifter » Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:59 am

I like it, it has a funky beat, and you can bug out to it... I give it a ten.

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Post by General K » Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:40 am

Grozoth, dude, where are you... missed ya!



:D

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Post by nimrod7 » Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:41 pm

What's the first law grozoth?

:smt017

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